Liam,
As I think I've made clear, there are experts who've chosen various paths to get to where they are, and I'm not making judgment calls on whose path is any better than anybody else's; the only person I get to choose for is myself. My precise point was that neither you nor I are in any position to argue technique with people whose abilities are so far beyond our own and that, by doing so, we insult them and waste their time. I mentioned 4 individuals by name who seem to be solidly above the rest of us in knowledge and experience, and should be easily recognizable as such. Only half of them are PMTS guys. I appreciate your attempt at casting me as a PMTS zealot as an argumentative tactic, but it's hardly an accurate characterization.
Honestly, reading through the nature of the posts, you'd think it was me who was being driven away (and yet, here I am).
Odd, that. The guy who says the primary purpose of internet discussion fora is to argue with people who know more than he does sticks around for another argument. I'm shocked. In case you hadn't noticed, 3 of the 4 guys I mentioned as being particularly knowledgeable no longer post here. I'm going to guess they're not as interested in the dialectic as you are, given that the stuff that got Josh banned was him losing his cool over said dialectic.
I don't think anyone doubts Greg's experthood or skilled skiing analysis abilities because we disagreed (sort of disagreed, I might add) over hop turns.
Hey, we agree on something. I don't think your comments diminish Greg's credibility at all.
You can quote any expert you want to make just about any point you want. The point is that you're in no position to make the criticism. Let the experts argue amongst themselves, and we can all learn something from their interactions. You arguing by cut & paste accomplishes nothing useful, because much subtlety and perspective is lost. The simple fact remains that you behave in a way on the internet that you wouldn't dare in real life, because you know very well that arguing with a guy who's got 10x your skill makes you look like an idiot when everybody just saw the two of you skiing side by side. Why pull that crap on the internet? What good does it accomplish?
Dan, for you who just 'likes to learn' from the experts, well what's preventing you? A recommendation from one skier to another to consider hop turns (and a bullet proof side slip...even more important and useful than a hop turn)?? You're a player on the PMTS forum, don't you get your fill of the bonafide experts there??
Maybe you didn't notice that 3 of the 4 I mentioned have stopped posting here over the past several weeks. It's tough to learn from guys who aren't talking. That's what I'm annoyed about, and the only reason I haven't let this go. I'm hardly a "player" on the PMTS forum. I've got an account and don't post much. I've spoken elsewhere about my feelings on the heavy-handedness with which that forum is run, and I had developed a fondness for the more open communication here. I've also got this crazy idea that, with a little work, we can end this stupid PMTS/PSIA fight and act like civil human beings to each other.
Also, where was all this impassioned defense of listening to the experts when Bushwacker was the one on the chopping block? Problem was, he ain't really your kind of expert.
Actually, the problem was that I was far from a computer when that elapsed, and I got a summary of what happened via PM when I got back, after it had all been cleaned up by the moderation team. Thanks for trying to pin me as being partisan, though; you did a great job forgetting about my open support for lifting Josh's ban, both before and after skiing with him. I'm sure Max_501 thought I was a PMTS partisan when I got on his case about holding onto old crap from Epic, as well as a variety of others at various times, as well.
You're welcome to have the last word. I'm about done here.
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