Author Topic: Ski's for wife - advice please  (Read 340 times)

Rimmel

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Ski's for wife - advice please
« on: March 12, 2008, 06:57:24 am »
I've gone and done it now, the trouble and strife wan't new Ski's when we arrive in Andorra. Therefore I am creating a shortlist.

Shes 135 pounds 5 foot 7 inches, Skiing level (fairly new at Skiing, can parallel turn, sticks to Blues and easy reds.. all groomed). But like me will be Skiing a lot more in the new couple of seasons.

So I *think we'll need a forgiving ski with room for improvement. I know they wont last forever...

thanks in advance
Rimmel

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midwif

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #1 on: March 12, 2008, 01:06:04 pm »
Hello Rimmel
For starters, I want you to know that I COMPLETELY agree with trouble and strifes desire to keep pace with your ski acquisitions.
Second, I am no gear maven, but did a bit demoing this year. Before compiling this short list, I also scrolled thru the reviews to see which skis seemed comptabile with your wifes skill level. So take my suggestions with a grain of salt, is what I am  saying.
Suggested Demo list:

Fischer Vision Breeze: good reviews, a great line of skis with a good reputation. I demoed the slightly more advanced Vision Vapor and strongly considered it as the one to get. From your description of her abilities and stats, the Breeze seems more suited to her at this point.

Dynastar Exclusive Active: good reviews. No personal knowledge.


Head Every Thang: good reviews, I bought this year after demoing twice. Good all around ski, very versatile, very light, but does not chatter much.

K2 One Luv. I demoed this ski at Steamboat.  Liked it but thought the softness of the flex would be an issue in northeast conditions. The K2 line has excellent word of mouth from women skiers I have talked with.

Hope this is helpful
"Play it Sam"

Svend

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #2 on: March 12, 2008, 09:57:55 pm »
Rimmel,

My wife is exactly the same height and weight as yours, and she demoed a bunch of skis last year, some of which may still be available as current carry-over models, or you might pick up a new 06/07 model for a great discount (a great way to save money on a starter ski).  Having said that, she skied quite a bit as a kid, and then only a couple of times since then (she is now in her 40's), and started up skiing again 3 years ago.  She is quite athletic, and was at an advanced level of skiing when she demoed, so keep her perspective in mind when you read her comments.

She demoed four skis:

Fischer Vision 73 -- women's all mountain ski, 73mm waist, 163 length.  Nice ski...relatively agile, stable, well-behaved, reasonably quick edge-to-edge (not great, but pretty good for a wider ski), good in chopped up snow and crud; very good edge hold on icy eastern runs.  Nice and light, too.  She liked these, but wanted something more high-performance (see below).

K2 Burnin Luv -- women's all mountain ski (not sure of the sidecut dimensions. 68mm waist, I think), 160 length.  Somewhat heavy underfoot, not lively, not agile, not quick edge-to-edge.  Basically she thought these were dull and boring, and too much effort to get some fun out of them.  Lifeless and lacklustre.

Stockli Laser Cross -- unisex all mountain ski, 72 mm waist, 160 length.  Swiss-made performance ski; quite stiff; great edge hold; reasonably quick edge-to-edge, super stable and blasted through all crud and junk that she could find.  Great ski, very fast, but lacked the agility and lightness she was looking for.  She would recommend this only for experienced skiers, and heavier women who could flex them; she was too light.  Not good for learning.

Head Hot Thang -- carving ski, 63 mm waist, 163 length.  Very agile! She was smiling ear-to-ear when she skied these. She was able to make super quick short turns, and then open them up on long wide runs without problem.  Very light underfoot; OK stability in crud, good edge grip on ice, lots of fun in bumps.  A ski for groomers only because of the narrow waist.  These would be very easy to learn on.  Very forgiving and not demanding, but not a wimpy beginner ski either.  She could grow into these nicely.  In general, Head makes damp, well-behaved skis, that are still agile and fun, without being overly heavy and cumbersome.  They seem to have this equation figured out, as opposed to other makers.

Atomic Balanze -- women's all mountain ski; not sure which model.  Her friend skis these, and is about the same height as my wife but a little heavier (~150 lbs.).  These are her friend's comments:  very heavy underfoot; too wide in the shovel and tail for eastern conditions (when do we ever get enough powder where we need a 125mm tip? or whatever the dimension is...let's just say they're too wide for the east); reasonably good at short turns; not quick edge-to-edge; stable at speed and in the crud.  But...they're just no fun.  Basically she bought these without demoing or reading any reviews -- walked into a big box sports store, they were on sale, they looked pretty, she bought them.  Skied on them 2 years, and now she regrets buying them.  She hates them.  She always complains that they weigh too much, and feel that way when she skis, too.

At the end of all this, my wife chose the Head Supershape Speed, 163 cm, which is basically a high-performance, detuned racing ski.  She wanted something with some horsepower and agility too, and got it in spades.  This is not a ski for learning on, but for her style of skiing, she loves it.  She didn't demo these, but went on recommendations and reviews.  She couldn't be happier.  Sadly for me, she now skis waaay faster than me, and I am in need of new boards just to keep up  ;D

Hope this helps.  Let me know if you have any other questions.

Svend

Rimmel

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #3 on: March 13, 2008, 04:21:33 am »
Thanks for the replies - appreciated.

Shes actually had her eye on the "K2 One Luv" as suggested by midwif... what size would you recommened? 160?.

thanks again
Rimmel


Rimmel

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #4 on: March 13, 2008, 01:29:42 pm »
Thanks again for the reply - much appreciated.

Svend

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #5 on: March 15, 2008, 11:16:23 am »
My only advice at this point is not to get skis that are too heavy.  Eg. -- our friend's Atomic Balanze skis (they are the B11 model, women's Metrons) must weigh close to 20 pounds or more.  At your wife's 130 pounds, that's about 1/6th of her body weight! For a strong athletic woman, that may be OK, but for one who isn't, such skis will feel like lead pipes on her feet, and she won't enjoy the learning process.  Good luck...

jim-ratliff

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #6 on: March 15, 2008, 12:19:08 pm »
I concur with the weight comment, even though they weigh 0 when you are standing on them.? ?;D
I think you should also give consideration to the Head Every Thang that midwif selected.? I don't believe that would be too much ski for your wife, and it will grow with her for a long time, and they are really light and easy to lug around.

An all-around do everything well ski.?
« Last Edit: March 15, 2008, 01:09:26 pm by gandalf »
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Svend

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #7 on: March 15, 2008, 09:44:14 pm »
Quote
they weigh 0 when you are standing on them
True...gravity does become your friend when one is in a superior aspect to an object.  Good one Jim!

Still, a skier does need some muscle power every now and then to steer and control the skis.  The lighter they are, the easier and less tiring this becomes.

Svend

drewti

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #8 on: March 20, 2008, 12:22:00 pm »

I am new to this forum and not sure that I am posting correctly however I am in the same boat and need to get new skis for the wife.  She is the same height and weight as your and has the same skiing ability.  She however does not like the new shaped skis and prefers the old technique.  Since all the new models have pronounced side-cuts I am at a loss as to what to buy her.  Any suggestions?

Thanks
Drew

Rimmel,

My wife is exactly the same height and weight as yours, and she demoed a bunch of skis last year, some of which may still be available as current carry-over models, or you might pick up a new 06/07 model for a great discount (a great way to save money on a starter ski).? Having said that, she skied quite a bit as a kid, and then only a couple of times since then (she is now in her 40's), and started up skiing again 3 years ago.? She is quite athletic, and was at an advanced level of skiing when she demoed, so keep her perspective in mind when you read her comments.

She demoed four skis:

Fischer Vision 73 -- women's all mountain ski, 73mm waist, 163 length.? Nice ski...relatively agile, stable, well-behaved, reasonably quick edge-to-edge (not great, but pretty good for a wider ski), good in chopped up snow and crud; very good edge hold on icy eastern runs.? Nice and light, too.? She liked these, but wanted something more high-performance (see below).

K2 Burnin Luv -- women's all mountain ski (not sure of the sidecut dimensions. 68mm waist, I think), 160 length.? Somewhat heavy underfoot, not lively, not agile, not quick edge-to-edge.? Basically she thought these were dull and boring, and too much effort to get some fun out of them.? Lifeless and lacklustre.

Stockli Laser Cross -- unisex all mountain ski, 72 mm waist, 160 length.? Swiss-made performance ski; quite stiff; great edge hold; reasonably quick edge-to-edge, super stable and blasted through all crud and junk that she could find.? Great ski, very fast, but lacked the agility and lightness she was looking for.? She would recommend this only for experienced skiers, and heavier women who could flex them; she was too light.? Not good for learning.

Head Hot Thang -- carving ski, 63 mm waist, 163 length.? Very agile! She was smiling ear-to-ear when she skied these. She was able to make super quick short turns, and then open them up on long wide runs without problem.? Very light underfoot; OK stability in crud, good edge grip on ice, lots of fun in bumps.? A ski for groomers only because of the narrow waist.? These would be very easy to learn on.? Very forgiving and not demanding, but not a wimpy beginner ski either.? She could grow into these nicely.? In general, Head makes damp, well-behaved skis, that are still agile and fun, without being overly heavy and cumbersome.? They seem to have this equation figured out, as opposed to other makers.

Atomic Balanze -- women's all mountain ski; not sure which model.? Her friend skis these, and is about the same height as my wife but a little heavier (~150 lbs.).? These are her friend's comments:? very heavy underfoot; too wide in the shovel and tail for eastern conditions (when do we ever get enough powder where we need a 125mm tip? or whatever the dimension is...let's just say they're too wide for the east); reasonably good at short turns; not quick edge-to-edge; stable at speed and in the crud.? But...they're just no fun.? Basically she bought these without demoing or reading any reviews -- walked into a big box sports store, they were on sale, they looked pretty, she bought them.? Skied on them 2 years, and now she regrets buying them.? She hates them.? She always complains that they weigh too much, and feel that way when she skis, too.

At the end of all this, my wife chose the Head Supershape Speed, 163 cm, which is basically a high-performance, detuned racing ski.? She wanted something with some horsepower and agility too, and got it in spades.? This is not a ski for learning on, but for her style of skiing, she loves it.? She didn't demo these, but went on recommendations and reviews.? She couldn't be happier.? Sadly for me, she now skis waaay faster than me, and I am in need of new boards just to keep up? ;D

Hope this helps.? Let me know if you have any other questions.

Svend

jim-ratliff

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #9 on: March 20, 2008, 01:28:33 pm »
An approach.

1 - Look at the icons.? The blue upright skier and the black upright skier reflect skillsets based on traditional technique, as opposed to the "skiers in a tuck" icons that represent skiers working on (or already possessing) "modern technical skills".? I assume that there is no value judgement by Peter implied here, there are lots of people that have been skiing very well since before shaped skis came on the market.

2 - Look at the "soft edge" (or "skid" in prior years) values for the various skis.? The biggest difference in modern technique vs. older technique is the initiation of the turn.? New technique focuses on edge engagement leading into the carve, earlier technique relied upon a stem christie turn initiation (which was initially skid based and then the skier progressed to more parallel turns).? A ski that will allow you to skid the tails (a soft edge rating of 4 or 5) will support the earlier technique, a ski with a lower "soft edge" will feel like it grabs or bucks as you try to push the tails into the new ski directioni.

FWIW, many of the very good skis (short of slalom skis or hyper carvers) will support traditional technique very well (or at least so I hear).? Early shaped skis didn't necessarily have this flexibility.

NOTE:? This is not a list of suggested skis, just examples of what you might look for in the ski reviews.
? ? Fischer Vision Vapor - upright black icon, soft edge rating of 4 (but still a clean carve rating of 4)?
? ? Head Every Thang - upright black icon, soft edge rating of 4 (but still a clean carve rating of 4)
? ? Head Power Thang - Upright black icon, soft edge rating of 4 (clean carve of 5)? = more of a carver, but still a candidate.
? ? Elan Black Magic - soft edge rating of 2, no upright icons, comment of "Requires well developed cross under carving skills" == would not be a good choice


demo - demo - demo


« Last Edit: March 20, 2008, 10:15:33 pm by jim-ratliff »
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drewti

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #10 on: March 20, 2008, 04:12:14 pm »
Thanks.  good advice.  I didn't realize that the upright skiers ment traditional. 

jim-ratliff

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #11 on: March 21, 2008, 07:52:22 am »

another thought.

Don't get skis with too small a turn radius, because they will feel "squirrelly" when skiing flat on the bases. It isn't really a big deal (they just wobble a bit and a bit of edge solves the problem), but for someone coming from relatively straight skis who may already have a bit of a bias against shaped skis, it is a behavior that "justifies their concerns".  The longer the turn radius (the less the sidecut) the less noticeable this behavior will be.  Probably don't want anything less than a 15m turn radius, or  at least certainly should demo some shorter and longer radius skis so she feels the behavior and knows whether its a problem or not..
"If you're gonna play the game boy, ya gotta learn to play it right."

bf_hill

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #12 on: March 21, 2008, 10:19:48 am »

another thought.

Don't get skis with too small a turn radius, because they will feel "squirrelly" when skiing flat on the bases. It isn't really a big deal (they just wobble a bit and a bit of edge solves the problem), but for someone coming from relatively straight skis who may already have a bit of a bias against shaped skis, it is a behavior that "justifies their concerns".? The longer the turn radius (the less the sidecut) the less noticeable this behavior will be.? Probably don't want anything less than a 15m turn radius, or? at least certainly should demo some shorter and longer radius skis so she feels the behavior and knows whether its a problem or not..

That describes my first experience with shaped skis perfectly.? The rental guy pushed me into skis that were too small.? The were squirrelly (great word) and I had to go from edge to edge constantly.? I only took one run and traded them up.? BIG difference.? They were still less stable than my old, (okay, really old) skis but more tolerable.? And the improvement in easier, quicker turning was worth it then.  If only I could tell you the lengths.

It would be helpful to know that kind of stuff in advance.
« Last Edit: March 21, 2008, 10:22:35 am by bf_hill »

Gary

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Re: Ski's for wife - advice please
« Reply #13 on: March 24, 2008, 12:05:30 pm »
Hopefully the wife's skis issue has been thoroughly expressed.

Just a thought on those "turny" skis.

My 165 Supershapes have a 12 m turning radius. I skied them in ankle to shin high snow this past week in Whistler. They are fast and not at all twitchy in the straight line and carve like an electric knife on Easter. Keep in mind I'm talking in bounds kinds of straight line speeds.

Sometimes a short radius turning ski will feel squirlly because of alignment issues. If your ankle is not neutral inside thr boot and shins and knees are not aligned in your boots so your skis rest perfectly flat on the ground...those narrow waisted skis will be taking you for a ride espcially at speed....a mind of their own. Wider skis won't react as violently if your alignment is off...just more surface mass and less sidecut to keep you connected.

The key here is get aligned and neutral, find your center on your ski and then....ski them all...skinny, mid-fat, fat and extremely fat...

It's all good....very good!

Gary