OTG Goggles/Helmet Fit

[byronm]

Hey Guys,
 
I could use some help with equipment. I am a spectacle...wearer, have a narrow/thin facial profile and small head. (Can't wear contacts) I have been using Scott Storm OTG goggles which while they envelope 3/4 of my face, work fine...w/out a helmet. I have tried on numerous helmets and all push my goggles down and the helmet up to a point where both are ill fitting.
 
Frustrated, I gave up my search for an OTG/Helmet combo. Until....concerned with my safety, S.O. threw the trump card...basically saying, O.K., don't worry about getting a helmet...unless you might ever want to "snuggle" again..
 
Soo...I am again looking for a goggle/helmet combo that will work. Obvously the goggles are going to have to be lower profile and built to fit a narrow face with glasses. I have considered junior or womens goggles but have yet to try any of those. Have also considered the visored helmet (but wonder if the visor would keep my eyes from watering on cold days at speed)
 
Does anyone have the same issue, maybe a junior or ms. skier that might have similar features and fit problems?
 
Any suggestions regarding equip that I might target as potential try on's would be greatly appreciated.
 
 
 

[jbotti]

I don't wear glasses (use contacts instead) but I did wear the Smith TurboFan OTG goggles for two seasons. They were great and they left no gap with my helmet. The turbofan was also great because you can put it on at any time and it unfogs your goggles and your glasses. Great product!!

[byronm]

Thx J...are the turbo fans lower profile? Helmet combo? My problem with virtually all the helmets I tried is that the goggles had "too" good of a seal...pushed the helmet up too far on my head and pressured the bridge of my nose to the point that it was like wearing swimming nose plugs.
 
I have been looking at these....won't really know until I try..but just an example..to give you an idea...I have a 6 3/4 head size.
 
http://activesportswearoutlet.com/childrens/goggles/gordini_ultra_vision_jr.html

[Perry]

It will be interesting to see what Todd says.  He wears glasses and uses the Smith Turbo fan goggle.  My guess is that if you can find a Smith helmet to fit you should be in business.

[meput]

I am a glasses wearer. Traditional goggles lead to both goggle and glasses fogging. Smith fan goggles work well but the deep design does constrict your field of vision (I have been hit from the side, by a ski instructor no less). I also have a pair of Wiley-X glasses with foam gasket that works well, but does not give much coverage on cold days. The most elegant  and functional answer so far is my OSBE helmet/visor. No fogging while skiing, excellent field of vision, warm even in single digit temps. The current visor version with foam air dam prevents air buffeting. Furthermore great conversation piece. Good review on the RealSkiers subscription site.

[byronm]

Thx Meput...I had in fact read the RS equip review and was interested...review s on the OSBE site were also good as expected...my only reservation other than $$ was a review on another site that described eye watering at speed. I noted within the RS review that particular attention needs to be paid to visor fit (I have not been able to look at one up close as no shop down here carries them) Since you don't seem to have that issue, do you reckon the eye watering review by one owner boiled down to ill fit?
 
I guess, at the end of the day, when you combine quality goggles with a less expensive non visored helmet...same same. Any tips on fitting or where to aquire?
 
just FYI...doing some browsing I found another helmet visor combo...they don't appear to have nearly as many "visored" style/fit options and availability seems primarily localized to  euro....cant find a review......but interesting none the less.
 
http://www.optical-group.com/fr/3770-snow?p=2
 
 
 
 
 
 

[Svend]

Byron,  have you looked at prescription goggles? Then you wouldn't have to worry about a goggle fitting over your glasses.....the goggles ARE the glasses.....

Smith has this interesting adapter insert system that fits into three of their standard goggles:

http://www.smithoptics.ca/products/#/Goggles/Snow+Goggles/Prescription+Goggles+Rx/ODS2-RX+Adaptor/view/

Pretty reasonable price, too. 

Bolle has a similar adapter, which fits more models (10):

http://www.bolle.com/technology/goggle/default.aspx  Click on Sports Optical System

If you don't have a funky prescription, maybe these will work for you....

[jim-ratliff]

Byron:

I have the Smith Variant helmet and Smith OTG goggles and they fit together well.  I've been using Turbo Fan goggles for several years now, and really like them.  There are two models for different size/shape faces; and I use the larger sized models but if you have a narrower face then you should try them on.  The corners of my frames hit the inside of the lens on the narrower models.

I have found that since I started riding bicycles in the summertime my goggles don't fog up as much in the wintertime, however.   

I looked at and tried the OSBE helmets at Vail in December. I found a size that fit me pretty well, but they didn't fit Lynn's head as well  -- so as with all helmets good to try before you buy.  I think that there is an OSBE-like helmet in my near future, possibly before next year.  My concerns are whether or not the lens quality for low light is as good as my current Smith sensor mirror (and similar from other manufacturers).  Classic goggle manufacturers have been fighting for the best flat and low light capabilities in their goggles for a number of years.

From what the store (and Meput) described, swapping visors isn't an outdoor or in the lodge activity -- wish it were easier without small lose-able pieces.  Also, a modification that Meput says they have made (and his goggle has) is a foam dam added to the bottom of the visor to better block air. That may explain the other review complaining of watering eyes from too much wind at speed.

I think the OSBE is a good enough new product that there may be significant introductions/reactions by the classic helmet manufacturers.  Like system skis where they no longer had to compete for skis and bindings, this presents the opportunity for helmet manufacturers to sell a single item that is price comparable with what has normally been a two purchase transaction (goggle and helmet).  I'm waiting to see what the classic manufacturers do to react to the OSBE helmet. (and I've heard that VIST has a similar helmet, I don't know anything about it).

Svend: I've considered corrective inserts in the goggles, but I'm so near sighted that I would be blind every time I removed the goggles, which I sometimes do on the lift and always do in the lodge.  I decided it was too much of a headache to go hunting for real glasses as soon as I walked indoors. Obviously, people with lesser corrections wouldn't have this problem.
     Also, once you reach the age of 55 plus your near vision starts changing pretty frequently and it would a pain to also have to get new prescription inserts every two years along with new glasses.
    Of course, the biggest advantage of wearing glasses is that I never have trouble finding them when I need them because they are on my face.




PS. But MOST OF ALL, I'm glad you are going to wear a helmet no matter what the inducement.

[meput]

Byron,
My OSBE came from OSBEusa.com. Very quick to ship. Easy to deal with when I found the first helmet size too small. I think they run slightly small, so any question on size, order up. The visor change is the simple addition of a foam air dam at the bottom of the visor that closes some of the space between the visor and the face/nose. My son has a pre air dam version. He liked the additional air dam when he tried one of my visors. OSBE has provided 2 foam air dams to modify his visors to be like mine. Jim's comment about changing the visors is valid about not wanting to change them outdoors. Would be easy to do indoors. Requires no tools to change the visor.

My eyes have teared up behind the visor and my glasses with the OSBE system. My eyes have also teared up with my fan goggles, Wiley-X's with foam gaskets to seal against my face, traditional sunglasses and regular glasses. Tearing is normal protective response of the eyes to wind and secondary drying of the eyes. Tearing is not uncommon for me, I do tend to move along as I ski  .

I have not tried goggles with a lens carrier for prescription RX. I have used lens carriers with sport glasses (Rudy Project) that are smaller than traditional frames so there is decreased field of vision through the rx portion. I have gravitated away from them towards the Wiley-X glasses for biking and spring skiing. I would think you would have similar fogging issues with a pair of goggles with prescription lens carriers as you do with traditional glasses and goggles. The fit issues of wearing glasses with their temples and placing goggles over them would be the only benefit of the integral lens carriers. As Jim pointed out, you would then need to carry a pair of glasses for the times you take the goggles off.

I look at the current OSBE system cost as equal to a new helmet and new goggles. The OSBE does come with both a yellow/amber visor and a dark smoke visor. I am interested in trying the mirror visor.

I know many people who use contacts for skiing and other sports. The price and potential aggravation of occasional contact lens wear would make the OSBE system seem cheap.

I agree with Jim. Wear the helmet - did I mention I have been run into by a ski instructor  .

Jim 2

[byronm]

Hola All,
 
First of all, let me say a BIG thanks for the feedback and information. As I read and re-read posts in response to this question, and others I have posed, it reaffirmed what a valuable collective resource this forum, aka (you all) has been to me. I am duly impressed with the amount of insightful, objective and relevent information provided by those with a plethora of experience(s). The personal time offered, depth of reflection and civility inherent on this forum is perhaps what makes it unique and seperate from others. As a newer member, I just thought it warranted mention.
 
With that said, whether warm and fuzzy or eyes slamming the back of your head, let me get to it and update on the helmet/goggle saga.
 
I have reached out to several shops exploring the option of a smaller framed OTG as Jim mentioned as well as rx device option mentioned by Svend. I dug out my prescription which is not too irregular and posed questions to the shops in my area relative to frame size and how they might fit my stealthy face. Concern with either the RX device or standard style OTG (based on limited info via web) seems to indicate manufacturers are forced to gravitate towards a minimum of "medium" frame structure to accomodate. I haven't gotten any substantive info back on the issue and what models they have in stock to warrant the hour drive for a fit test. FWIW....ego not an issue, I have posed and will be interested to note how the higher end women's models handle OTG or RX and fit.
 
Now to helmets, thx meput for the excellent info and like jim I am leaning towards the OSBE option just based on convienence and cumulative costs of seperate apparatus'..s.s.s? I contacted OSBE and indeed they have a generous return/service policy.
 
After accidentally finding the actual patent application for a visored helmet, which to speak to Jim's point, may be obstructive or delay other potential makers (not that our u.s. patent system isn't sound or up to date)   For comparison's sake I picked up on the opt that VIST might be making a similar helmet and indeed they do. 
 
http://www.vist.it/en/Company/Contact.html
 
Good luck getting ahold of any shop that has them or even knows about them. I called two in Vail, one in UT and one in VT that were listed on the vist website. All carry VIST equip of one sort or another but most said, "hugh??" when I asked about a visored helmet. I  emailed the company in Italy (I think) for more info. However, I perused some of their other equip and fashion offerings at various u.s. sites, judging from the price points on those items, I "expect" that should one find the helmet, it will be...let's say "pretty spendy" compared to the OSBE.
 
Quick question for Meput....are the helmets on the OSBE site all pictured without the air dam? and if so...How does the air dam compare to the looks of the VIST? (looks really functional if the fit were right) Perhaps not enough for a second mtg on my house tho..
 
Thus, unless the creek rises or a helmet/goggle combo epiphany is realized within the next few days, I plan to order the osbe.
 
Again, thx for all the input.
 
 
 
 

[jim-ratliff]

Hola All,
 
First of all, let me say a BIG thanks for the feedback and information. As I read and re-read posts in response to this question, and others I have posed, it reaffirmed what a valuable collective resource this forum, aka (you all) has been to me. I am duly impressed with the amount of insightful, objective and relevent information provided by those with a plethora of experience(s). The personal time offered, depth of reflection and civility inherent on this forum is perhaps what makes it unique and seperate from others. As a newer member, I just thought it warranted mention.

Byron:
On behalf of all of us, thanks very much for posting that.  And, of all the things you mentioned, I think the civility, the way we can treat each other with respect even when we have different opinions is the most important. Let us hope that it can remain that way.
And, while that civility may sometimes require some conscious restraint and not truly be "inherent" in us, it is definitely "apparent" and I appreciate that everyone strives to behave as such.
Jim

[meput]

Byron,

Thank you for your comments about the forum. The members have to be civil to put up with me  . Lynn (midwif), Jim#1 and Todd probably had uncivil thoughts about me this last weekend when I dragged them down Ripcord at Sugarbush  .

The OSBE air dam is a simple foam piece that sticks to the inside (face side) of the visor along the bottom edge of the visor. It is not visible from the front, nor does it change the appearance of the visor. According to OSBE, all the visors came from Italy without the air dam. When the air dam was deemed to be an improvement, OSBE Italy sent the air dam foam stickies to OSBEusa. OSBEusa has been applying them to the visors on the helmets as they are sold/shipped. The air dam should be a replaceable item if need be. The Vist helmet/visor has a more finished appearance than the OSBE that I am sure you would really pay for if you could find it here in the USA.

Jim#2

[byronm]

Agreed on the cost Jim. One fella I talked to about the vist helmet thought the starting price was around $399 sans tax.
 
Checked out Sugarbush and jealous of you all's access to vastly more diverse and larger skidom than I. J2...I noticed that "Ripcord" transitions into "Heaven's Gate". Pondering the implication there...
 
Disappointed that my plans to ski tomorrow in Flagstaff fell through, partner sick.
 
Additionally, to miss a feable opportunity to gloat in the face what looks to be great resort in lieu of the fact that I would have been skiing Weds. (albeit humble terrain and conditions) to golfing in shorts and 70* on Thur. 
 
All is not lost tho....still golfing Thur and with a year older coming up...I get to ski next week for free...providing the snow holds up....
 

[ToddW]

Lynn (midwif), Jim#1 and Todd probably had uncivil thoughts about me this last weekend when I dragged them down Ripcord at Sugarbush  .

I was ready to give it another go, so no uncivil thoughts here.  I was only thinking positive thoughts ... especially about my files and the wisdom of having gotten up early to touch up the previous day's abuse at K-mart.  Thanks for playing tour guide.

[jim-ratliff]

Jim:  No un-civil thoughts here.  It was icy and slippery but not life threatening.  Look for piles of powder, pick where to turn. It wasn't the only place on the mountain with those surface conditions.


By the way, I have some pictures of you reverse transitioning and making all your turns on the inside foot.  I didn't notice that until I was looking at the video on the television.  Very smooth, good balance.