4x4's came in the other day!

[Ron]

Well, they are certainly not a off-piste, soft snow ski   nice ski, looking forward to getting on them. Very stiff fairly heavy ski. These are overstock/closeouts so Dynastar shipped with px12's not that much difference from the 14's; maybe a few oz's lighter.  I will check the edge bevel on these and get the bases prepped. I moved the bindings +1 to start.

[Gary]

Did you weigh them...how much do they weigh?

Did you sharpen, wax bottoms...polish tops...come on...fess up!!!! ALl the details.....

Are they going to be your Vroom Vroom skis?

Any now, you've got to take 3 little piggies to market....ya need the 3 tube!!!!!  udaman!
 
Nice get,   
G

[Ron]

1- heavy
2-checked base sides, a little off on the bases- no polishing tops ....   base wax and will put one more on.
3- yes, vroom skis, no doubt
4- 3 tube ordered from Phil

[Gary]

Come on now Ron....any good skier worth their weight in Greek Yougart knows what their skis weigh...

Put em on the scale!

Poor things...no shinny tops....tsk tsk tsk...

g

[Ron]

what exactly is yougart??

[Gary]

Yougart is a substance made in Youganastan. This national companies marketing department recognized how popular Greek Yogurt was and decided to capitalize on the Greek name.....since Yougart Yogurt is not memorable....the decision was made to go with Greek Yougart.  Their logo: "Same yummy taste just west of Greece!"


And that's the story I'm stickn' with! 

G

[Ron]

coming from you, it all makes senses....

[LivingProof]

So let's talk about "heavy" skis. All mine qualify as "heavy", especially when compared to the Pilgrims Gary was skiing on last spring. I remember leaving JH hole last year at 5am and both Ron and Gary carried my Hart skis. Both commented they were heavy, and, they were.

But dead weight does not translate into poor skiing performance. The Hart's rocked at speed so lack of chatter is a real plus. I know the engineering concepts of inertia state that weight at the tips of skies will make them harder to turn, but weight at the center, such as heavier bindings, will have minimal impact on turning. I've never thought of skies once they were on your feet as "heavy" and we all are wearing boots which are also heavy. So I guess that to the leg muscles, just one ski does not feel heavy, after all it carries your full body weight easily.

So my question is, what's the benefit of really light skis? Just asking.

[jim-ratliff]

Hmmm.?

Lighter skis are much less strain on the knees when riding the chairlift.
Lighter skis are easier on the shoulders when carrying them.?
Lighter skis are easier on the arms when lifting them into the Gondola racks.?
Lighter skis are easier to roll through the airport?
Lighter skis may contribute to not going over the 40 pound limit for ski/boot bag combined weight.

Lighter skis may be easier for lighter skiers to bend (if lighter implies softer, but carbon fiber skis may not be soft)?
Less inertia or momentum (not sure which is the right engineering term).? A lighter ski should/could feel more lively and responsive, but that is also part of design and construction materials so hard to isolate.

"Inertia = harder to turn" only if you are spinning the skis like a bicycle wheel.? I don't believe inertia is much of an issue when tipping and engaging the edges to turn.

[Gary]

Mike....My Super Shapes are very heavy skis...I think in many cases the heavy skis can be more stable at higher speeds, maybe less chattering. Honestly, I don't notice the extra weight when skiing, only when I carry them around.

Lighter skis can be stable, less tiring, maybe quicker, easier to carry around....but at high speeds, I think that a board that's a few pounds heavier, is more stable.

Usually too with the weight comes stiffness....the choice really boils down what works for the individuals physical make up as well as ski skills.

Now...tote that load.....

Best,
g

[LivingProof]

I raised this discussion point because in the OP Ron described his new Dynastars as "heavy". Almost all reviews of that ski include a reference to the weight, yet, almost all reviews are very positive as an eastern carver. I really want to demo Icelantic's because I'm fascinated by how light they are, and, are loved by my fellow posters. We seem to value low weight for all the things Jim describes, especially if your carrying your own plus significant others skis. Yet, in ski performance, the real critical value, a pound or two may not mean much.

Lift that bale, tow that barge. Ski too fast and you'll end in ....the Jackson Hole Clinic

[jim-ratliff]

I will say that my Watea 84's are very light (perhaps as much as a pound or two less than the iM78 similar length) and they feel light when I ski them, but I think a lot of that is the use of Carbon beams instead of metal laminates for strength and stiffness.? On some really icy crust at SnowBasin last year they handled the adverse conditions amazingly well.

[Ron]

the major difference really is much more noticeable in off-piste conditions where you may be poling and skating (think how much you will lift your feet/legs), walking/hiking.  Skiing with light skis is less on the legs overall especially where you are sucking up legs, lifting and such in piled snow, tight shots, drops and technical terrain. It's not as noticeable on-piste/skiing on groomers. They do wear on my knees hanging down while on the lfts.

PS- if you think Gary's Pilgrim's are light, wait to you feel my pilgrims's and nomad's mounted with Jester/Griffons. There's a noticeable difference.

[jim-ratliff]

OOOHHHH.      Ron is right on target here, but in a different way for me.  The most noticeable effect of ski weight is when I fall in powder and have to lift my feet (with skis attached) to get all connected and oreinted in the right direction to get back up.  VERY much appreciate lighter weight here.  But one of these days I won't fall as much.

[Ron]

Jim, if you ain't fallin' you ain't pushin' it!     I fall all the time as well. Many times I expect to fall but it's all in the learning. No shame in falling. It's better than the folks who don't take the chance. BTW- kicking the boards over to the downhill side to get up takes effort!